"Sadly Israel doomed itself from the start. Instead of the Zionists coming to Palestine as friends to cooperate with the resident Arabs to make a better life for all, the Zionists came as brutal ruthless invaders intent upon driving out the local inhabitants and occupying their land." Jews have been a part of Palestine/Holy Land since the first census of the region was taken around 1860. Zionists went to Israel for one goal: Zionism. Zionism is the belief that Israel is the Jewish homeland. Local inhabitants were not "driven out" (some say driven out, some say ran away, and others say encouraged to leave but it was a combination of all three) until FOREIGN invading armies attacked Israel in 1948. Look at the population figures for the times. Opinions are great, but when they are not backed up by facts you end up looking like an idiot, whether you agree w/ Bibi or not.

Beyond the fact that your comment reads like a usage example of the phrase "gross oversimplification", you also misinterpret the words of the piece on which you write. Though Mr. Walt's sensationalist title clearly intends to befuddle, Jews in Israel are not currently a minority ruling over a majority: the definition of apartheid. Furthermore, If you read the piece you will see that Mr. Walt in fact defends the "Zionist dream" in his opening paragraph by contrasting it to what he perceives as Netanyahu's despotic statements, so not only is your description of "ruthless invaders" historically fallacious, but also not in agreement with the article.

Thanks Mr. Walt for your sincerity!!!
I only hope more Americans would think just like you, this world would be a different place!
Its incredible what happens in your country.
Its not even worth to mention the us marine jar-head commentary, why don't u dig a hole a put your head inside, you will do us a big favor!!!!

The performance by Congress as Netanyahu delivered his Apartheid Speech was as embarrassing as it was dangerous...Congress would have been right if they had only shown their support for Israel's safety and well-being as Israel's ally but not for right-wing Israeli politicians policies of illegal West Bank colonization and apartheid-like discrimination of Palestinians...Netanyahu revealed himself to be more interested West Bank colonization and apartheid than peace, Congress shouldn't enable him.

"The delirious applause for Bibi of course was clear evidence of the fearsome power of the Israel Lobby in US politics."

It was unseemly.

The NY Times had it exactly right: the Congress gave some many standing ovations that it looked for all the world as if they had decided to listen to that speech standing up.

After all, if you are going to leap to your feet THAT often then you may as well not bother sitting back down again.

Still, cults will be cults......

Though without doubt, the msot expensive rent-a-crowd in history.

>> ...not like many of our presidents who send us (marines, servicemembers) in to do the fighting for them.

Very funny. You soudl just like George Bush, who pretended to be a fighter pilot when in realy, his father got him into the National Guard so he could spend the Vietnam year gettign drunk, taking drugs and partying.

>> Even your buddy Dan Drezner from Foreign Policy publicly called your book "piss-poor scholarship."

You mean the same Dan Drezner, the Dick Cheney fan? Too funny.

For Likud.

Polls taken in Israel reveal that Bibbi and Congress are even to the right of Israel.

>> The Gallup Poll has indicated support for Israel at about 60% and for the Palestinians at less than 20% for the past five years.

Anotehr poll shows that most Americans suport a Palestinian state and than a majority also support the arab Revolution, even if it has negative consequences for Israel. That Gallup Poll also mentions that Israel is ranked only 7th or 8th in terms of the foreign countries Americans consideres most important to the US.

>> Isn't that what the congress is supposed to do?

Congress is elected to represent the interests of the American pulblic, not a foreign government. How many polls show that Americans hare happy with the US givign over 10 billion a year to Israel while schools, police services and garbage collection is being cut in their own districts?

A piss-poor Marine should know.

know a lot more than you do. now go get a job and get off your lazy rear.

Here is a March, 2011 post from my blog http://bit.ly/IsraeliCultinCongress

"something happening in Jordan" doesn't really bode well for Israel. It doesn't bode well for US leaders who imagine we have some influence and control there. Democracy that we fear may well take over there, whither Israel then? Israelis are cowards and have too much to lose. They will leave, whereas the Arabs have nothing to lose and everything to gain. Time is on their side.

From Commentary Magazine's "Contentions" Weblog
May 24, 2011

In Spite of Obama’s Ambush, Netanyahu Still Goes Home a Winner

By Jonathan S. Tobin

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s speech to Congress today will illustrate a fact that was largely obscured by the controversy over President Obama’s Middle East policy speech. The Jewish state enjoys overwhelming and bipartisan support in this country.

Cynics will ascribe the support to the “Israel Lobby”—a.k.a. AIPAC—which has been holding its annual conference in the capital the last couple of days — or some other pro-Zionist force. But what conspiracy theorists like Stephen Walt and John Mearsheimer (authors of The Israel Lobby) and their media ilk never seem to understand is that the cabal they believe manipulates U.S. policy is so large it encompasses both major political parties and an overwhelming majority of the American people.

As some have noted, the Republican Party seems to be trending more pro-Israel and the Democrats less in recent years. Yet as Alana reported earlier this morning, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid and the House Minority Whip Steny Hoyer both implicitly rebuked the president in their speeches to AIPAC. The reservoir of support for Israel and even for Netanyahu, who has again become something of a lightening rod for those who dislike his country, is strong both in Congress and the country. In spite of the fact that Obama specifically chose to ambush Netanyahu by lobbing his bombshell about the 1967 lines a day before the Israeli arrived in Washington for a visit, then—an almost unprecedented discourtesy for an ally—the prime minister will be loudly cheered today when he explains why Israel will not and cannot be forced back to those insecure borders. . . .

. . . In spite of the criticism he has taken for having the chutzpah to talk back to Obama, Netanyahu will return home with the cheers of Congress still echoing in his ears secure in the knowledge that there is only so far that the president can go in his campaign to pressure Israel. That is a feeling that David Ben Gurion would have loved to experience.

--Posted By By Jonathan S. Tobin 05.24.2011 - 10:24 AM

Copyright Commentary Magazine 1997-2011 All Rights Reserved

http://www.commentarymagazine.com/2011/05/24/in-spite-of-obama's-ambush-netanyahu-still-goes-home-a-winner/

That is just the problem: thanks to the Israel Lobby and its power the US is glued to Israel and is following it to disaster in the long term in its war on Islam. Israel can't win and neither can the US as long as it stayed glued to Israel. Why the US would want to be virtually the only friend of the most hated nation on earth is quite a puzzle, although the Lobby and its power to confuse Americans re their true interests explains a lot of it.

USMARINE101,

I'm wondering how this works, perhaps you could enlighten me. Do your Hasbara handlers assign a blog or group of blogs for you to post on? Do you get paid by the post or by the hour?

The US did not invade Iraq to strengthen Iran. That was an unintended consequence, not foreseen by the Neocons who were so eager to start the war. The US invaded Iraq for a combination of reasons, but mainly to please Israel that thought Iraq might be a threat. In any case Iraq was an "upstart" Muslim nation not under our thumb like Jordan and Israel and Kuwait and so it was ripe to be crushed. The US got nothing from the war. Israel got a possible threat trashed and destroyed at no cost to it, but at a vast cost to its hitman, the USA.

to say "Jordan, Arabia, and Kuwait." Israel is not under our thumb; we are more under its thumb, as it were.

I'm quite sure of that.

Further, I'm quite sure that is the American people that will decide that they have had enough of footing the bill for Israeli fascism and in a little time will vote with their feet to stop this ridiculous charade that threatens the entire world.

Israel is, right now, a fascist state that threatens the entire world. Openly.

>> Bin Laden decided that he hated the US not so much because of Israel and the US support for it, but because the Saudi royal family chose to let US marines into Saudi Arabia as a buffer against Saddam.

There was nothing in Bin Laden's 1996 Fatwa that made one more significant than the other, though it is beyind duispute that he was radicalized by the Israel atatck on the Qana refugee Camp.

Kaleid Sheik Mohammed's mtive was US suport for Israel, as was his son, Ramsi Yuossef, who bombed the WTC.

Of course US foreign policy is not guided by Israel.Just becasue the invading Iraq of strengthened Iran, does not mena Israel was not entirely for it.

Israel ranks only 8th in terms of the countries that Americans regard as important to the US.

Next time, do your own fact checking buddy.

. but in term of popular support it still has a vast majority in USA. at least be honest about that.

I think the Dems could do it with and win more votes than it costs them. Progressive Jews would support them, but many Americans--especially many 3rd party voters would fill the ranks. It might hurt Dem. fund-raising, but let me assure you, there are many who are quite suspect of Israel, that would love a clear vote. It's not political suicide, it's political cowardice.

That he has such a staunchly supportive following in Israel, don't you think?

Have you read his history? What is yours?

You'd be surprised by how much people here know.

But you probably wouldn't be interested. Well, that's childhood for you. What a pity you lack the wisdom and courage of the nine year old Avnery.

a marine.

He's a holocasut survivor, so knows more about this stuff than you ever will.

As for siding with dspots and terrorists, israel sided with the Shah, then supported the Mullah;s against Iraq, then supported Mubarak against the revolution and now, they're setting off bombs in Tehran.

FYI. The US supports both the MEK and Jundula, listed as terrorist organizations by the State Department.

growing up there I for sure know this.......

He is also not a holocaust survivor. He left Germany in 1933, before the death camps were set up.

Come on man, do some fact checks before you post stufff.......

>> growing up there I for sure know this.......

So you admit you're an Israeli.

I stand corrected about him being a Holocaust survivor, but he did experience first had bruitality at the hands of Nazis.

Legally, I mean.

Among international norms, there is perhaps none more peremptory (even more so than self-defense) than the right of a people to the dignity of sovereignty among nations. Were s/res/242 to come into conflict with this norm, then it could very well be that the entire charter of the UN is null and void. Which may not bother you. It wouldn't bother a lot of folks, but just to put some perspective on your point.

Were any UNSC resolution to overturn this norm, then empires of enslaved nations would then become "legal." Which isn't so different than what Israel is attempting.

Israel tore up 242 and have rejected it long ago (remember the bit about ending the occupation?) so the Palestinians have no choice but to go direct to the UN (242 is after all, a UN Resolution).

Isael clerly don't want to " work for a just and lasting peace in which every State in the area can live in security"

Hamas is not even mentioned in 242 BTW.

You're just reptealign Bibbi's nonsense and saying that the only thing that counts from 242 "negotiations", which the Palestine Papers revealed, is a sham.

No Hudna, no end run around peace negotiations. Right of States to live in peace within secure and recognized boundaries, free from threats or acts of force."

Netanyahu completely rejected the resolution in every sense other than vague platitudes about talks. In factr, by insisting that there woudl be a permanent presence of Israeli troops in the West Bank, he rejwecte the most important part of 242.

Nice effort anyway.

The problem was in 1948 when 750 000 Palestinians were driven from their homes by violence and the threat of violence by well armed and well -supported Israeli forces. Arab volunteer armies came to the defense of the Palestinians, but being they were on horseback with flimsy rifles(1 for every 2 fighters apparently) while Israel had armaments secured by Zionists in American and Europe, they really had very little chance. Israel was well prepared as Israel records show the plan was always to drive out the Palestinians from their home. From day one.

BTW Palestinians are NOT asking for 'Jselm' as their capital. As you well know. It's EAST Jerusalem as per their RIGHTS under international law.

Zionist continue to ethnically cleanse East Jslem as well as harrassing, attacking and the killing of Jselem Palestinians by settler groups.

Israel will eventually have to leave Palestine or create one state for Jews, Pals, Christians.

That's the only way or Israel will be gone in less than 20 years.

but since when have facts been of anhy revelance to his diatribes?

>> actually 68% of all palestinians who fled in 1948

Where did you get the 68% figure from? In any case, those that never saw an Israeli miltia member didn't need to if they'd hear fo teh massacre at Deir Yassin.

>> They were supported by the modern armies of egypt, Jordan, Lebanon, Iraq, and other foreign contingents.

Your ignorance is satounding. The Jordanian Legion didn't ghet involved ubntil 5 montsh after Israel had begun expelling Palestinians. The Palestinians has nothign mroe than WWI rifles with hardly any bullets, and only one rifle to share among 2 or 3 men at a time.

That meant that every Palestinian fighter and his crude weapons (old rifle) had to face 6 well trained Jewish soldiers armed to the teeth and backed up by an air force.

They certainly have no tanks or airplanes.

>> The Jews just had a few scouting planes and 3 tanks!

Israel had an airforce. They took over teh British bases and camps handed to them by the British. The British even left their weapons, arms, tanks and vehicles and munition to the Zionist forces. This included 2,700 government buildings, 50 train stations, 3,000 km of paved roads, a number of sea ports, and 37 military camps filled with weapons and space parts.

When they withdrew, the head of teh british Command in Palestine said that the Haganah was powerful enuogh to easily overcome the Arab armies.

>> Exactly, when the west bank and gaza were controlled by Jordan and Egypt, respectively, the Palestinians wanted to destroy and take over Pre-1967 Israel.

False. The Palestinians were out gunned and out armed, but all they wanted was to return to their villages.
>> The Phased Plan calls for Palestinians to create a state on any land that is given to them, and to use that land as a launching ground for attacks against Israel, with the end goal, to take over all of Israel.

Ben-Gurion had the same plan in 1937, and managed to convince the Zionist Congress to accept the 1947 Partition by assuring them that it was only the first step in reclaiming all of Palestine.
Yassir Arafat's that USMARINE101 quoted referred exclusively to the occupied territories BTW.

I know we were armed with rifles, grenades, stens, and a lot of british weapons. Same as the Jews were.

We also had support of the Arab Liberation Army that was armed by syria and other arabs during the time u say that the palestine people were kicked out before jordan invasion.

the jews were pretty poorly armed at this time too. they had WWI weapons, no artillery or tank or plane. they had a few british weapon as well.

AGain, I dont know where you learn ur history but surely it is not from facts or books.

they sent men in to battle without rifle. then they were told to take it off of fallen comrades....

they trained with broomsticks and other things since they had not enough rifle....

The Isralis were armed to the teeth.

The British had disarmed the Arabs, but allowed the Zionist militis to remain armed. Between 1936 and 39, they demolished 250 homes as an act fo colelctive punishment for any sign of wepoans on any propoerty.

Meanwhile, Ben-Gurion convionved the wealthy American Jews leaders to pay for arms manufactuing machinery, which was delivered to the Zionists in Palestine, so they made their own weapons.

By the time the British let, easch Palestinian armed with a WWI era rifle was up agaist 6 Jewish militia men with state of the art weapons.

Last but not least, the British left all their weapons behnid and gace them to the Israelis, including tanks armored vehicles, army vehicles guns, army bases etc.

>> I know we were armed with rifles, grenades, stens, and a lot of british weapons. Same as the Jews were.

The difefrebnce beeein that the Jews jhhad state fo the art wepoans and an abundance of them whereas the Arabs had WWI era rifles and no ammunition.

The Arab Liberation Army barely lifted an finger and some welathier land owners had to sell their land to finance the purchase of guns.

The Jews were extrenmely well armed and even had an airforce by the time the British withdrwew. They inhereited al the weapons and miliatry bases the British left behind, including tanks.

I can assure you I have a much better grip of the fact than you.

"Palestinians are not Israeli citizens and refuse to even recognize Israel."

Palestinians who live in Israel are Israeli citizens.

Palestinians refuse to recognize the legitimacy of Israel as a 'Jewish state" which Bibi insists on so as to make them accept their dispossession.

Not going to happen obviously. Nobody would agree to those terms.

But you make it sound like their being unreasonable, lol.

But that's Zionism for you. Completely out of touch with the modern world...

Husseini was in exile from 1937 and never returned to Palestine. He was the only one who had anything to do with the Nazis.

From 1936 – 1939, the Palestinians were completely leaderless, right up until 1948. The British smashed the Arab Revolt and drove out the Palestinian leadership.

Mind you, there are 51 documents outlining the collaboration between the stern and the Nazis.

Husseini was living in berlin during the nazi time and broadcasting to the arab world to support the nazis. He gave ideas to nazis to kill jews too. there are many documents to prove this and he was considered a war criminal by the british and allies.

And the Mufti Huseeini was head of a palestinian military force of about 11,000 fighters during 1948 war, so he played a large role. He had the support of the holy war army.

again, please fact check before you post wrong information dudeee..........

AHMEDWALID

6:57 AM ET

May 27, 2011

actually neoleft you are wrong again

Husseini was living in berlin during the nazi time and broadcasting to the arab world to support the nazis. He gave ideas to nazis to kill jews too. there are many documents to prove this and he was considered a war criminal by the british and allies.

And the Mufti Huseeini was head of a palestinian military force of about 11,000 fighters during 1948 war, so he played a large role. He had the support of the holy war army.

again, please fact check before you post wrong information dudeee..........